INCMA Forum Posts Archive 3:
 
Date: 07/22/00 12:39:35 AM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Mascots

I know most of you who own or are active in a Christian Martial Arts your mascot, is probably God, or Jesus, but do you have any others? Not necessarly an animal, but it could be, but maybe some symbol that is primarly perdominant in your patch, that is if you have one?
I have seen some like my old school with a Cross, centered, which was the key of the mascot. The color, yellow signified the fact that it was a primary color, and also, to reflect light, the true light.
I have seen some sites on the web that have other Biblical images, such as the fish, as the second most common thing. Others include the Bible, A shield, which comes from Ephesians 6:1-2, and many others like that.
I have also seen animals, such as the Eagle, which is not only the Nation of America's mascot, but also stated in Isiah, not sure of the verse, stating of that of those who will soar like wings of an eagle, I seen some of a serpent, like that when Moses laid his staff down, and a serpant appeared, and may others.

Other than the most important of God and Jesus, what do you use? What does it mean. Where, if you have a Biblical verse does it coorespond with. Is it in the patch, if you have one?

Thanks,
Vicki 



Date: 08/18/00 02:38:44 PM
Name: Ricky

Email: Crippler4h1@hotmail.com

Subject: Re: Mascots

Article:
Well Vicki, u know we have talked about it, i like your idea on the eagle patch, or a Cross would be good, but i personally really dont like crosses cause, it reminds u that Jesus died, big deal everyone dies, the wonderful thing about Jesus is that He arose in 3 days after being dead, but thats just might point. The fish would be good, u know it was used by early Christians, so that would be cool too. 



Date: 08/20/00 08:50:46 PM
Name: Philip A. Payne

Email: fiw@angelfire.com

Subject: Re: Mascots

Article:
Is it not aazing how He works? Just last night He resolved for me a conflict related to mascots.
Before I answered the call to minister, I was already teaching the martial arts. I had several schools in different areas, each of which operated under a different name, but all of them used a white tiger as their symbol to make obvious their conection. My base school was and is still known as the White Tiger school of the Warrior Tradition.
For some time now I have wrestled with this, because so many people look at the name and say, "What does a white tiger have to do with God or Jesus?" I had determined that I should do away wiht the symbol entirely, despite the fact it would mean giving up a widely recognized trade mark of sorts and thereby cut the number of new students coming through the doors who would in turn hear the message and, I hope, be saved.
Last night I prayed on the matter and as I did so, the following thought was stuck in my brain:

W Warriors
H He's
I Inspired
T To
E Evangelize

T Together
I In
G God
E Everyone's
R Reached

The next time someone asks me what a white tiger has to do with God and Jesus, I'll have an answer for them and the ministry will benefit from the recognized symbol of the school.

Yours in the Warrior Tradition,
His humble steward,
Philip A. Payne, benefactor. 



Date: 07/22/00 12:46:26 AM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Video Form Exchange Ideas?

For those of you who do forms, patterns or katas, depending on what you call them, how many do you have? Since starting a new school, recently, I have found it interesting to learn new katas, since I already know 22 from my old school, not counting demonstration forms and weapons. I have already learned eight forms in my new style, 2 of which are simular to my old forms. The names are chaning, and the forms are slightly different, but I consider it a new form, since the strikes differ. I noticed from watching other students, that more forms to follow are again simular.
I find it interesting to see how my style was taekwondo based, which is usually Korean, to be somewhat simular to Kyokushinkai Karate based, which is Japanse. I am starting to like kata even more than I used to, which also it has always been my favorite aspect of the martial arts.
For those interested, I am wanting to put together a tape of what I know in kata from my old school, and then also from my new school, in slow motion, to show what it looks like. I am also intersted in seeing other styles as well. Styles like kenpo, especially, and other styles of taekwondo, like that of ATA, ITF, or WTF forms, that are not simular to what I know already interest me. ATA in this area is expensive, and the Taejuk forms are hard to find in this area.
If you are intersted, what we could do, is send out in email the addresses of those interested. Then we can make copies of what we know, and then we, the one sending it out, pay the postage, of sending the tape, and pay for the blank tape. In exchange, we just get the other person's tape.
This is a great way, to watch the technique of other schools, and see how they work, and maybe even apply them in our own. Who knows.
Just a thought.

Vicki 



Date: 07/22/00 07:03:56 PM
Name: Sovann

Email: pens@juno.com

Subject: Re: Video Form Exchange Ideas?

Article:
Didn't some TKD forms come from Shotokan?
-Sovann 



Date: 07/22/00 10:53:00 PM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Re: Re: Video Form Exchange Ideas?

Article:
In my taekwondo system, yes, some of our forms were from shotokan.
Pyungahn Cho Dan,
Pyungahn Ee Dan,
Pyungahn Sahm Dan,
Pyungahn Sah Dan,
Pyungahn O Dan,
Bah Sae So

and I am not sure of any others. The first five, are the Heign forms, and the other is like their Bah Sae Dai. Sorry for the Japanese mispellings. I still am not yet familur w/ all the Japanese terminology.



Date: 07/22/00 08:54:15 PM
Name: Mark McGee

Email: mmcgee@gmaf.og

Subject: Re: Video Form Exchange Ideas?

Article:
Many of the styles have similar katas today. I found many of the same forms in my studies of Japanese, Okinawan and Korean martial arts through the years. I would have to remember to turn left instead of right or block up instead of down depending on what style I was practicing, but the basics are the same. Though Chinese forms are sometimes different than forms from other countries' systems, basic movements and combinations are repeated throughout the martial arts world.

Katas teach us much about the arts, as do wazas and bunkai. They are wonderful for preparing a student in his or her practice. They can keep a young student interested in the art long enough to really learn something. How many people today would spend their first three years in the martial arts "standing" in postures rather than kicking, punching, jumping, spinning, sparring, throwing and grappling? We know that standing exercises are paramount to having true internal power in the arts, but most newcomers wouldn't stand for it (pun intended!). Kata is important in many ways, but it is not the end or ultimate of the arts. The best form is "no form". That's the ability to move naturally in any situation without thought about what response would be appropriate. No thought is moving like a lively dragon moving in water. The dragon has no thought of self defense. It responds to life naturally. That's our goal as martial artists and Christians.

Hwa-Yu T'ai-Chi Ch'uan is the current Chinese art I practice and teach. Grand Master John Chung Li was a Christian. Current Master Robert Xavier is a Christian. The art of Hwa Yu has 67 forms. Hwa Yu 15 Animal Kung Fu has 16 forms. Master Xavier and I are in the process of shooting and editing instructional video tapes for both the Hwa Yu Long Form (67) and the 15 Animal Form (16). We have an introductory tape available now. Let me know if you are interested in seeing it.

In Christ's Love and Grace,

Mark McGee
Grace Martial Arts Fellowship
www.gmaf.org
mmcgee@gmaf.org



Date: 07/22/00 10:54:12 PM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Re: Re: Video Form Exchange Ideas?

Article:
Wow, that is a lot of forms. How much, if any charge to get an idea of your forms? I am on a Walmart salary, and a college budget, but just am curious.
Thanks.



Date: 07/22/00 01:01:36 AM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Attaining the splits

For those of you who can do the splits, congrats! For those of you who can not do the splits, that is just fine, keep working at it. I have been in the martial arts for almost five years now, in and out of places, since the departure of my old school, and have acheived my black belt, and still can not do the splits. I came close, but then in December of 1997 when I was soon to be a red belt, I was involved in a car accident that shoved my tailbone out of line, and dropped my right hip about half an inch out of line. To this day, it's not exaclty right, but it does not bother me as much as it first did.
I have heard, and read many statistics about those trying to do the splits, and please do not take any offense ok?

Women are more tolorable to pain. +
Women have deeper hip sockets. -

Men are less tolorable to pain. -
Men have shallower hip sockets. +

What that means is because men have shallower hip sockets, they are more likely to be able to do the splits, easier however, women more are likely to succeed quicker is because they can tolorate more pain.

This is not to imply that men are week, and women are different, but to imply that male and female are different when it comes to attaining the splits.

What are some recommendations of stetching that help you work on the splits, and how is your progress going?

My old school did the butterfly stretch, and modifying it some. We worked on bringing the feet together, pressing the knees down to the floor, and then at the same time push the chest out, rolling the knot of your belt, (or bellybutton) to the floor, arching the back, and then back donw, relaxed. We did this about ten times, and then on the last one, held in the position for about 30 seconds. It also stengthens the back some as well. We also sat down, in a strattle position, and then rotate the hip foward, like that of the butterfly stretch, with the toes pointed towards you. After a minute or two, we would point the toes away, stretch out a little further, and then do it again, hips rotating. Last, we point the toes foward, towards yourself, and then stretch out as far as you can go, and rotate the hips. By watching our old instructor, Mr. Blackstone, he was more able to do the splits further, if he rotated his pelvic and hip bones towards the floor. When he did this, his splits were past 180 degrees.

My new instructor, Sensei Edwards, allows us to stand up stretching into the splits, but not to go till it hurts. I myself do not see this to work as much, so before class, I work on my regular stretching to get more of a work out.

What do you do? Again I ask, but wanted to see what works. I am open to any new ideas, but I still with my previous hip injury have to still be careful with my right hip. I still have to do my hip exercises once or twice a week, to keep it strong.

Thanks,
Vicki



Date: 07/24/00 11:39:40 AM
Name: David Lieder

Email: dlieder@rmi.net

Subject: Re: Attaining the splits

Article:
Laying on the floor up against the wall with your legs on the wall letting gravity pull them down is an excellent way of achieving the splits. Also we have just recently purchase one of those split machines and it seems to be helping.

David



 Date: 07/24/00 01:57:31 PM
Name: David Lieder

Email: dlieder@rmi.net

Subject: Re: Re: Attaining the splits

Article:
I also have found that while sitting in the steam sauna at the local health club really loosens up the muscles. I do a lot of stretching while in the sauna. I will sit there in a butterfly position. I push down with arms. I push up with legs against arms. I pull myself down to feet. I just sit there relaxed also.

David 



Date: 07/22/00 07:02:34 PM
Name: Sovann

Email: pens@juno.com

Subject: Re: Attaining the splits

Article:
Not that I can do the splits either , but there are two stretches I'd recommend. Do the butterfly stretch with your hips facing the floor and your arms in push up position(you, end up looking like a frog). Make sure you are warm, and you want to do the butterfly stretch first. Also lay down with your legs up against the wall and let your legs hand down the sides allowing gravity to stretch them.
I can almost do the splits to the front/back but it's been a LONG time since I've come close to doing them to the side.
-Sovann 



Date: 07/22/00 08:38:00 PM
Name: Gary Westemeyer

Email: WestemG777@aol.com

Subject: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Hello everyone,
I am new to the board and I have thoroughly enjoyed reading some of your messages. However, I have a question I'd like to pose to the board. What is everyones feelings about bowing in a Christian TKD environment? I have been having my students do a modified bow, making sure that we only bow and honor before the Lord. I have been having some thoughts about changing this and I wanted the members of the boards opinion. Thank you and God bless everyone.

In His service,
Gary Westemeyer 



  Date: 08/20/00 08:31:34 PM
Name: Philip A. Payne

Email: fiw@angelfire.com

Subject: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
In our classes, we have done away with bowing all togther for just the reason you stated. Before I began devising the Ken-shen ryu Bushi-jujitsu system for use as a ministry tool, I had my students bow because it's tradition, but it always bothered me.
The solution I came up with is this: At the begining and end of every class, the students form a circle to symbolize the perfection of His creation. Jewish tradition tells us that the center of a circle is representative of Him amid the universe He created. The Bible tells us that at his name every knee should bend, so I have one of the students say "Y'shua," the Hebrew name for Jesus and we all go to one knee facing the center of the circle. Then someone offers a prayer and class is begun or ended as needed.
The term "master" always bothered me too. Therefore, I have reserved that position within the system for Him. No mortal will ever attain that position.
I hope this helps.
Yours in the Warrior Tradition,
His humble steward,
Philip A. Payne, benefactor. 



 Date: 08/20/00 10:01:36 PM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Re: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
My old school had your philosophy too on the term "master". We had never used it for anyone of high ranking of a black belt. Mr. Blackstone was a 5th when I started, and later promoted to 6th, but we still called him Mr. Blackstone, Mr. B., or Sir.

The only place you ever saw the term used, was on the door of the school, where it said:

Robert Blackstone's Karate Institute
"Where Jesus is Master"

And then the phone number.

Vicki 



Date: 08/20/00 10:44:37 PM
Name: John R. Himes

Email: yohane@eolas-net.ne.jp

Subject: Re: Re: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
Philip, I agree with you about the term "master." You have a Biblical reason for that position. (Matt. 23:8-12) However, I'm having a hard time digesting your stand on bowing. Do you have a Biblical reason for your position on that one or is it just a preference?

I certainly hope this is just a preference on your part and not a conviction. Every single Christian I know in Japan, Japanese or foreign missionary, would be mystified. We all bow in respect to each other, just as they did in Bible times. The tradition has continued over here in Asia though it did not in the Western world.

In Christ,

John R. Himes
Asahikawa, Japan 



Date: 08/23/00 12:00:06 PM
Name: Philip A. Payne

Email: fiw@angelfire.com

Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
John,
First let me begin by saying, I am not trying to point fingers. I have nothing against showing respect to one's fellow human being, be it through the act of bowing or shaking hands. What we do in Ken-shen ryu Bushi-jujitsu is just one more way of showing our submission to His will. Remember, the kneeling is done at His name when we begin and end with prayer.
I do have several Bible passages which back this up:

Isaiah 45:22-24 "By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked: Before me every knee will bow; by me every tongue will swear."

Romans 14:10-12 "It is written: 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, `every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.'"

Philippians 2:9 "that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth,"

I am not trying to say that every Christian martial artist needs to take up this practice. It is something that we do and so I thought I'd share it since the question was asked.
Yours in the warrior tradition,
His humble steward,
Philip A. Payne, benefactor. 



Date: 08/23/00 12:00:06 PM
Name: Philip A. Payne

Email: fiw@angelfire.com

Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
John,
First let me begin by saying, I am not trying to point fingers. I have nothing against showing respect to one's fellow human being, be it through the act of bowing or shaking hands. What we do in Ken-shen ryu Bushi-jujitsu is just one more way of showing our submission to His will. Remember, the kneeling is done at His name when we begin and end with prayer.
I do have several Bible passages which back this up:

Isaiah 45:22-24 "By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked: Before me every knee will bow; by me every tongue will swear."

Romans 14:10-12 "It is written: 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, `every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.'"

Philippians 2:9 "that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth,"

I am not trying to say that every Christian martial artist needs to take up this practice. It is something that we do and so I thought I'd share it since the question was asked.
Yours in the warrior tradition,
His humble steward,
Philip A. Payne, benefactor. 



Date: 08/24/00 03:57:19 AM
Name: John R. Himes

Email: yohane@eolas-net.ne.jp

Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
Hello again, Philip.

Thanks for your answer. I totally agree that every knee will bow to Christ, and I think your custom of bowing the knee to Him is just great. You have excellent Biblical support for that. As the Word says, all will bow to Him eventually. In the church I pastor, we all bow to him in prayer together at our Wed. evening prayer meeting, kneeling in a circle and praying one by one.

What I was wondering was why you quit bowing to one another, and if you have Biblical reasons for that. I had no doubts about why you bow to Christ.

God bless.

John 



Date: 07/24/00 11:37:44 AM
Name: David Lieder

Email: dlieder@rmi.net

Subject: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
Bowing should be only a sign of respect. Just like a hand shake. It should be explained to all students this way. From what I have found the bow should only be about 10 degrees.

David 



Date: 07/23/00 02:51:19 PM
Name: Wes and Terrie

Email:

Subject: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
Gary...

In our opinion "bowing" is simply a show of respect,and means
nor signifies anything controversial,,,In todays world,,,we think
that some kids have less and less to show respect for,even
though they desperatly need to,,,In Wes's class the kids know
that they bow to show respect to the flag,the instructor,
each other, hope this helps,and welcome to the board.....

Wes & Terrie 



Date: 07/23/00 01:24:24 AM
Name: John R. Himes

Email: yohane@eolas-net.ne.jp

Subject: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
Hello from Asia! Maybe I can set your mind at ease about bowing. Please remember that bowing to one another is a very ancient sign of respect and greeting, probably much older than shaking hands. It occurs all through the Bible with no rebuke as long as it is person to person and not bowing to an idol.

I have been a missionary to Japan since 1981 and never known a missionary or a Japanese pastor or believer who felt bowing to one another was wrong. Asians think of bowing just Americans think of shaking hands. Last night we had our unsaved neighbors, the Gotoh family, over for tacos (the Mexican kind; the Japanese word "tako" means octopus–which tastes good if cooked right!) and we all bowed to each other in greeting and as they left.

There are times, however, when bowing can be inappropriate or even sinful. First of all, bowing to idols is a terrible insult to the true God. Most Japanese martial arts schools have a "god shelf" in the corner, and they bow to the idol as part of their opening ceremonies. I know a Japanese pastor who started a church by renting a Karate dojo, and he always covered the idol with a sheet for his services.

Secondly, bowing to a photograph or statue (of the style's founder, for example) is usually a form of ancestor worship, and would be wrong. For example, Japanese bow and pray to a photo of the deceased at a funeral. Again, down at the Kodokan (headquarters for world Judo) in Tokyo I saw an old man bow and pray to a statue of Jigaro Kano, Judo's founder.

Thirdly, in my opinion the "zarei" (seated bow) to a standing person (for example, the instructor) should be avoided, though seated bows to one another are common over here if both are seated on a "tatami" mat and are not thought to be worship of any kind. However, once I was on visitation with another missionary and as we left, the "grandma" of the house did a seated bow to us and said, "You are like gods!" Shades of the Bible! (Acts 14:8-18) You can see why a seated bow to a standing person would probably not be wise.

I hope this is a help. Please answer on the forum or e-mail me if you have other questions.

John R. Himes
Asahikawa, Japan 



Date: 07/22/00 11:01:45 PM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Re: Bowing in a Christian TKD program

Article:
Not only in a Christian TKD program, but any Christian Martial Arts program, myself, I do not have a problem with bowing, because I understand the fact of bowing to more than one God is a problem. I do not see Martial Arts as a God. God is the first thing in my life, and martial arts, is not. I don't even literally bow, like that of the martial arts to God, but I do bow my head slightly when I pray to Him. I feel as long as you and your students undestand that this type of bow is out of respect, because of the backgrounds of where the martial arts comes from, it is just like an American handshake, or the European kiss on the cheeks. It's only out of respect, and greeting. If for some reason, the martial arts becomes the first thing in you or your students life, the bowing, can be taken another way, which is not a good thing to do. The term bowing, I think refers to also when people had idols, and would bow to them, and you know God is a jelous God with other gods.
If it feels uncomfortable with the heart, or gut feeling, then you might have a conviction feeling. My old school never did the bow, but however, those who competed sometimes did bow in class, to get used to it. However, it was never enforced. My new school does, before doing a form, after the form, before sparring, before class, after class, after sparring, and before and after entering the "dojo" but I am just perfectally fine with it. It did take some getting used to, but it didnt' take long.

Vicki 



Date: 07/22/00 11:10:15 PM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: How young is too young?

I was asked by one of my dad's coworkers to see if I could teach his two children martial arts, as a discipline enforcer, and also an self-esteme lifter upper for the oldest child. The two children are ages 3 and 12. I never taught a child at age three, but have taught many other children at age 12. I told the dad, with the 3 year old I would probably have to modify the program, some, but not too much. Just would have to have more emphasis on other things, to avoid losing him in his short attention span.
The father thought things over, and decided that this would not be a good time. So things were like it was never brought up.

Later on, just a week ago, another coworker, met with me, while I was waiting to pick my dad up at work, because I had his truck for some bill payings. He asked me if I was the martial artist, and I replied, yes. He asked me, if 4 is too young to start up the martial arts.

I told him in my old school, before Blackstone stepped down, we had a Kid Kick class for ages 4-6. They learned not only some kicks, punches, and basic tumbling, but they learned their names, addresses, and phone numbers. Along with all that, they were able to go up in rank but it was noticed that it was different than other ranks in regular class. Kids also learned to listen, to respect their elders, and to have fun with other kids their age.
He seemed to smile, and said, yes that would be a good thing for a kid to learn. He asked if other schools did that, and I said, in this area, no. Most schools here want kids at least age six or seven, or up. The schools that enforce competition probably around eight, inless they can show they are very mature for the age. Other schools, charge so much, and do not have a program to go along with their age level, so that it is so far beyond what they can attain.

What do you think, a certain age, limit to start? Do you think at a younger age, requirements should be differet, to get them in the right martial arts stage of mind. What else do you think? 



Date: 07/24/00 11:35:42 AM
Name: David Lieder

Email: dlieder@rmi.net

Subject: Re: How young is too young?

Article:
4 yrs is the youngest I have taught. I have a couple 4 yr olds now. 1 is sharp and is able to grasp things better than some 7 yr olds. The other is not as advanced and has a real short attention span. 3 seems a little young though. Although Tiger Woods did start playing golf at age 3.

David 



Date: 07/30/00 11:55:37 PM
Name: Sovann

Email: pens@juno.com

Subject: Re: Re: How young is too young?

Article:
We started allowing 5-6 year olds. That was a mistake. Later a wise master told me 8yrs old is the youngest he will teach and we adopted that. I think it depends on your instructors, your schedule and your goals and focus. Our classes were all ages seperated by rank. If I were a full-time MAist I think I would do a seperate kids class and mayby teach 6-7 year olds again. It was just kind of frustrating to try to teach teenagers and adults practical self-defense technique while trying to keep the kids interested. The ladies in the class wanted to do a cardio workout, the young guys wanted to spar hard and the kids wanted to goof off and be Power Rangers.

It is helpful to have an older sibling or parent to take class along with a younger student. It gets frustrating for them if they have to help discipline the child and they are trying to get a good workout.

It is so awesome to see a kid blosom and gain self-confidence and smile and feel appreciated and valued though.

Closer to home: my daughter would do horse stance, salutation, bow, punches, front and side kicks when she was 2 yrs old. Then one day she told me "Daddy, I WON'T do karate because I'm a LADY!!!" Now she just dances around all the time doing BALLET, making up songs about Jesus coming back and dying on the Cross. (I have tricked her into doing "wrestling" with me and she knows what a double-leg takedown, arm bar, figure-four and triangle choke are). She does like to hit BOB with sticks, and she will lecture you on punching properly with your thumb on the outside so you won't break it.

-Sovann 



Date: 07/26/00 05:22:37 PM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: School recognation

In my old school, we always tried to get students to acheive good grades in school. We had a black belt club, for any student of yellow belt and higher. What this club did is allow the child to get a belt with a black stripe down the center and also a patch to go on a sholder. The club basically means the students grades are at an A and B level, nothing lower, to avoid probation, and also to be able to progress sometimes quicker. The would be ones the instructor would call on to demonstrate a technique, and other stuff like that. Occassionally too, on good performances, they would be able to go first in lines for kicking mats, and other such activities. To get on the club, along with the good grades, the student much teach a class, all the way to their current rank, keep the grades up, and always stay on top of their requirements.

In my new school, I see one or two kids with red acadamic acheivers on them. They look pretty nice, and it's a good way for them to show they are also successful in school. I am not sure what else they do with academic improvements.

Do you and or your school do anything to encourage students to excel in school? If so, what?

Thanks,
Vicki 



Date: 08/25/00 09:49:30 AM
Name: Charles Owens

Email: owens@kidokyo.org

Subject: Re: School recognation

We have two curriculums (pee-wees, ages 4-6; juniors, ages 7-9)in which we offer a variety of patches to kids for special accomplishments such as best kicks, best punches, best form, student-of-the-month, perfect attendance, honor roll, academic achievement, special role model, etc. We also offer "star patches" of different colors for different things like attending special clinics, participating in special school or civic events, cleaning up their rooms, cleaning the dojang, attending Vacation Bible School, etc. If you need a resource for a wide variety of patches that are inexpensive, let me know.
I have learned that awarding different kinds of patches regularly to kids is a way to keep them striving for goals since belt promotions take a while for those ages. 



Date: 08/20/00 08:16:28 PM
Name: Philip A. Payne

Email: fiw@angelfire.com

Subject: Re: School recognation

Article:
In my classes, I don't use a recognition of that sort. However, I am very tough on grades. Every grading period the kids bring me their grade cards and if i see they are slipping, I limit the number of times they can come to class per week until the next report card and my wife, who is in school to be a teacher, tutors them.
By the next grade period,if the grades don't come back up a 3.0 GPA or higher, then they are out of class until they recover that average and my wife keeps working with them.
If a student wants to start in my class, I ask them what their grades are and if they are not 3.0 or higher, that's fine, but I let them know I expect them to strive for academic improvement and offer them Steph's (my wife) assistance from the get go.
I have had several kids and even a few parents tell me I am too tough on them, but a local principal has several times reffered "trouble kids" to me and recently named my class as one of the top ten school friendly extra curiculars in the school district.
Yours in the Warrior Tradition,
His humble steward,
Philip A. Payne, benefator.  



Date: 07/28/00 09:59:56 AM
Name: Gary Westemeyer

Email: WestemG777@aol.com

Subject: Re: School recognation

Article:
Vicki,

I have been throwing the idea around about recognizing grades by a patch or a different belt for some time, and I have come to the conclusion that "I don't know what to do!". We as Christian Martial Artists would like to think that our students are above the pettiness of saying that "I'm better in school than you are", but unfortunately the fact is, kids will be kids and they will do the teasing/taunting off-site where we can't see them or hear them.

We try to instill in the students the tenets of TKD, especially being courteous, but try as I might I still hear from other people how so and so is doing this or that, and it is very frustrating. Another thing, where exactly do you set the cutoff? Does the student have to have at least a B or better in EVERY class to qualify? What about PE? Most schools don't even give a grade in that class anymore, only pass/fail. Does the student have the special patch taken away if they get in trouble at the school that isn't academically related? There are a miriad of questions that we need to ask and I don't have the answers.

This is a good subject of conversation and if anyone else on the board has any input I would certainly be appreciative. 



Date: 07/29/00 12:26:15 AM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Re: Re: School recognation

Article:
Hi again.
In our school, if a student was caught saying things such as "I'm better than you" and such, they could loose a stripe, possibliy a belt. Students in the Black Belt club, especially could loose their black belt club privledges, and possibly rank as well.
In my county, we do not have P.E. Class, inless you are involved with basketball or some other main sport in school. Basically practice is your grade. I hated that, because in Wisconsin, we had P.E. for everyone, inless you had a real physical handicap.

Now I think what you can do to motivate a student, instead of saying you must have a "B" average or better, you can look at the student's past and present report cards, and then set a goal with them, to bring them up. If they are already at a straight A level, then encourage them to do it again. If the student ends up showing any progress on their report cards, a patch or some type of recogantion should be awarded. Even words are enough to some kids. Just remember, which I have learned too, not all kids are great in academics, but you can encourage them also, just give the best they can, and try to help them in any way, possible. Just always remind th students school comes first. 



Date: 07/20/00 12:01:37 AM
Name: Vicki (blackrat78)

Email: blackrat78@hotmail.com

Subject: Belt Tying

How do you tie your belt? Well, first I should ask what rank are you? When I took under Blackstone we all tied our belts the same, starting with the center of the belt at our belly button, bringing the left side, around the back, under the right side, then bring the right side, around the back, to the front left side, and then from there, we go with our know, which I can not explain. Our belt did not cross in the back at all. When I joined this new school, all ranks under black belt cross their belts, and I have no clue how to do that, but all black belts are to have the belt not to cross. That would have confused me if I had started with them, got used to crossing the belt, and then not having to do that, when you got to black, I would be the one to cross it. Good thing I never had to do that.
Do you if you do cross the belt, know why that is done? I never understood why.

Thanks,
Vicki